- Update on NA Game Servers
- Ghostcrawler looking for feedback on Champion ban system
- Thornmail changes in 5.16 and Ruby Sightstone ideas
- Immobile mages, state of LeBlanc, Vayne, Zyra & Sion
- Riot Engineering techblog
On August 25, the NA game servers are moving to Chicago, IL. We anticipate zero downtime. However, ranked will be disabled from approximately 5:00am PDT to 12:00pm PDT (noon). The migration will take several hours and, until itâ€™s complete some games will still be played on the old servers, so you may not immediately see a change in your ping. You may also bounce between Chicago and the old servers from game to game until the migration is complete. Read more about the server move here: http://riot.com/1E3AYXO
[ Taylor Meabon ] What’s your position on have 5 bans, maybe even 1 for each player? Its kind of frustrating to have none of your own input when 1 of 5 random people gets to ban 3. Also I think the champion pool is big enough to justify more bans?â€Ž Â
Timely question. We have had a few meetings on this topic lately. Would be interested in community feedback right now on what problems you think the existing system has and your opinions about the right way to fix.
(Also specify if you’re talking about pro play or non-pro ranked play. We don’t strictly have to use the same system for both.)
Here are the changes to Thornmail that will hit live with Patch 5.16:
- Price increased from 2100 Gold toÂ 2300
- UNIQUE Passive now reflects 15% of damage + 25% of the userâ€™s bonus Armor, changed from 30% of damage
If Thornmail comes out next patch and is too weak, it seems like the better approach to take would be to make it better at what it’s supposed to be good at rather than just making it good against all physical damage. It doesn’t really seem right that we should just make it really good against all physical damage. If we need an item that allows tanks and other frontliners to properly deal with Riven, we should make that item, rather than trying to balance an item with a largely different ideal case around also being able to do that.
We had something very close to this on Thornmail for awhile internally, but I believe it resulted in a question of what options auto attackers even have then if Thornmail not only damages them significantly, but also halves their Lifesteal.
What’s the intended outcome of this change? That Ruby Sightstone becomes generally more desirable to upgrade to? Or is it more that Ruby Sightstone feels better to upgrade to for a support when they manage to go full build?
Cool. Thanks for the interesting thread, Saixos. Sounds like people are maybe wanting more of an interesting transformative element when upgrading Sightstone. From what I’ve read, players seem okay with upgrading it late in the game, but even then, it’s mostly just because you can, and not that it feels good to do so.
Immobile mages definitely need the same treatment as what we’re doing for the juggernauts. Not because “buffs” (those can happen at any time), but because they really need true uniqueness from champ to champ.
If you asked the question “I’m a champ that brings a bunch of aoe spell damage and some CC, who am I?” you could answer Velkoz, Zyra, Syndra, Brand, Cass, Malzahar, and ziggs. Ideally we could find what makes these champs unique and sharpen it enough so that the reason you would bring those champs to your team isn’t just whoever has the highest numbers.
As for the buffs that you’re asking for, I’ll have to run it by the live balance team and they can better speak to if any of them are in an underpowered state.
[ Note ] There’s been some recent community feedback on Vayne’s early game being too strong. The posts from Repertoir are a continuation of those threads.
Where did we say this? Just talking around the office, that’s really not the impression I get. If you had said, “The fact that Vayne isn’t getting nerfed in 5.16 is sad really,” then that’s more reasonable. I can assure that in the last few days I’ve had several conversations about Vayne that weren’t just on the boards.
Is she getting changes in 5.16? No. However, that doesn’t necessarily mean we aren’t aware of the community sentiment on the subject.
[ Note ] You can find Meddler’s comment HERE.
One of the big issues that Ryze has currently that makes him feel weak is that for the “100 games played, master tier ryze player” he is actually very very strong, but for the average/majority of players that isn’t the case.
We’re slowly working on some changes that will hopefully shorten the gap in success between an insanely top tier ryze player and everyone else. Probably still a few patches out though.
That said, she historically falls into that Azir, Ryze, Kassadin, etc. category of champions that is balanced for higher levels of play when their solo queue win rate is in the ~45% range. This isn’t to say that any of these champions must be weak; it’s more that their performance dramatically increases with skill level and/or player experience, to the point that if they were balanced around a 50% win rate for all players, they would be 56/57%+ for experienced/skilled players. Most recently, we saw this on Ryze, whose experienced win rate jumped up above 60% by some measure despite being ~50% in solo queue at average elos.
We actually generally agree with this assessment, and I believe we’re currently looking into what we may be able to do to help Zyra out. I’m not sure if it’s going to come right away, and it’s not likely to be a large scale change, but she should get some attention nonetheless.
- Numerically he seems balanced, reasonable win rates on our data and all of the external sites like OP.GG etc
- As most sion players (myself included) prefer top sion over jungle, there may be room for a slight power shift towards top sion rather than jungle
- The W 2->3s delay nerf was warranted in terms of power, but the feels hit was probably not ideal. Maybe there’s a power neutral change that we can do to shorten that delay some without buffing him
I actually think the community outcry then was totally legitimate and called us out on what would have been changes that would have pushed out some of the core late game functions that lee sin players actually liked and aren’t unhealthy for the game. For context the changes would have made lee sin more of an attack speed dmg carry late game rather than a pick focused tank like he his now. This is the type of feedback/response that I am glad that we are doing.
There have been a few other threads with some more in depth Morde discussion, but I can repeat/bring the discussion here. We have heard the feedback on morde and are both reacting to some of it before release and planning for possible future changes if things don’t turn out exactly as we hope when he goes live. The big asks I’ve been seeing for morde are about his solo lane viability, and we are aiming to not hurt his play there while also adding a very new and interesting option for him to play bot lane. Once morde goes live, we will be listening to the feedback from top, mid, and bot lane morde players and reacting with whatever changes are appropriate.
Some of the other comments you have about us “picking sides” or “changing the whole game around lee sin” must be a deeper level of conspiracy than what we even know ourselves. The strategy the balance/systems team has been taking on creating/improving jungle diversity isn’t centered around lee sin but rather the champion pool as a whole. Things like Cinderhulk and Devourer are general changes to support other jungle characters that don’t really have anything to do with lee sin’s balance.
So admittedly some reworks and balance changes don’t turn out as good as others. That doesn’t mean that we are or should be taking a different approach or use different values for each individual champion. The changes made to the three champions you listed were consistent with the same design values that we apply to all champs in league.
That said, I know we’re not satisfied if cass, veigar, zil players aren’t so I’m sure that we will continue to iterate on those champs and keep improving them in the future.
Riot have released an official tech blog where they’ll share moreÂ under-the-hood aspects of updatingÂ League:
Hello, world! What a long, strange trip itâ€™s been. Some things have held constant since the beginning of Riot engineering: we still hold the player experience above all else, we still focus on constantly improving ourselves and our technology, and we still love to play games. But other things have dramatically changed for our team: we no longer fit in 500 square-feet, we now serve players all over the world, and supporting 1,000 concurrent players is no longer our biggest challenge. At the beginning of this journey, we couldnâ€™t have imagined the challenges thatâ€™d arise from the scale we face today, and that influence everything from the technology we create to how we shape a player-focused engineering team.
Iâ€™m excited to introduce Riotâ€™s new tech blog where weâ€™ll discuss engineering topics along the breadth of these challenges. League of Legends players have given us the awesome opportunity to tackle these problems, and weâ€™ve learned a ton that weâ€™d like to discuss. Our goal is to share with you, the engineering community, our journey developing technology while we learn from your questions and comments.
What you wonâ€™t find here is a discussion of technology for technologyâ€™s sake. Rather, whatâ€™s important is how and why we wield technology to ship value to players. In fact, Riot isnâ€™t a technology company, which might sound odd in the context of announcing a tech blog: Riotâ€™s a product company. We believe the only path to success is a focus on players, which means a focus on products.
A focus on products is why weâ€™re not only building League of Legends, but also new games, esports experiences, a merchandise store, creative ventures, big data pipelines, and more. Our engineers create the technology for those products to succeed in delighting players. As players ourselves, we know the joy of truly great game experiences, and weâ€™re dedicated to creating new ones.
We plan to discuss facets of our engineering challenges that we hope will resonate with the community. To release content at will, our teams must move quickly and own their work end-to-end; to support that need we’re developing private cloud infrastructure and working to evolve our continuous delivery platform. With our desire to make data-informed decisions, we’ve invested in our Insights Tech team and their work building out our global data pipeline to analyze petabytes of game data. In our quest to continually improve the LoL player experience, we’ve implemented machine-learning algorithms to better understand how players interact with our game, both positively and negatively. To maintain the highest level of availability of Riot’s game and web properties, we’ve placed them atop tech stacks comprised of both our own work and invaluable open-source technologies we couldn’t live without. And, in the constant battle to stay ahead of malicious attacks, we’re supporting our security team and their efforts running a bug bounty program, developing security tools, reviewing Riot code, and educating Riot engineers on cutting-edge trends and best practices.
Riot engineers from teams around the world look forward to sharing stories related to the topics mentioned here, among many others. This blog is our chance to engage with you and we want to focus on quality content and the dialogue that follows.
If you have any questions, feel free to ask me atÂ @NoL_ChefoÂ or e-mail me at firstname.lastname@example.org.